Religion, spirituality and my beliefs...

[logansrogue]

I'm kinda in a lost sort of place.

I'm reading this book called "Jesus and the Goddess" which has asserted a possibility that Jesus didn't really exist. I didn't like the idea. I've always accepted that he probably didn't exist like we're told he did. I don't expect that he's an ASWM with brown hair, blue eyes, blue robes and a girly pout, but I didn't think that no such teacher-guy existed at all.

Now I know a number of you aren't religious, but I have been brought up by a Catholic woman. She never made me do the things that Catholics do, but I've found Jesus and Mother Mary to be a reassuring presence in my life. I like the idea of a God that looks out for me, that loves me and guides me.

Yet, I can't join most churches, because I do not believe in the patriarchal controlling crap most of these places try to pull. And I disagree with the misogynistic crap in the Old Testament, and the mean Thou Shalt Not! God. That's just not me. I get told by some Christians that I'm not allowed to pick and choose. I have to accept all the bible or none of it. So I don't feel welcome to its wisdom (that is in there, underneath a bit of silly crap and violence).

I can't be a pagan either. Paganists don't tend to really get me. I believe in Jesus, yet I believe in a Goddess? How can that work? I follow Christ's teachings of love and acceptance of others, yet I worship the earth as a living, breathing entity that cares for me, a part of the great energy of the cosmos that made everything that is.

Gnosticism intrigued me, till I hit the bit with the 'secret teachings' and 'hidden mysticism'. That's not the way that true spirituality works for me. For me, it is open to all. All one has to do to be a part of the Spirit is to be good. I like the belief that we're all 'inherently good'. I also like to address the fact that we can all be very, very bad.

I just wish there was a religion that:

- Encouraged looking at *all* religions, to find a general 'truth'.
- Encouraged one to walk their own path to enlightenment.
- Didn't require belief to the exclusion of other religions
- Didn't keep anything 'secret' from the 'uinitiated'.
- Didn't assign stupid names for things (like the assholes that channel Angels and make up all this theoritical bullshit about the nature of the human spirit - if we could possibly comprehend it, we'd be like God. And we're not. So even trying to find a name for it is pointless. It's ineffable, and I'm happy enough to view it as such).

So anyway. Am lost. Am unhappy. I keep praying to God to guide me to a new place, to help me find my spirit home. If I don't find a religion that pleases me in the next ten years - fuck it all, I'm making up my own. Bwahahaha.

Comments

[annearchy.livejournal.com]

- Encouraged looking at *all* religions, to find a general 'truth'.
- Encouraged one to walk their own path to enlightenment.
- Didn't require belief to the exclusion of other religions
- Didn't keep anything 'secret' from the 'uinitiated'.
- Didn't assign stupid names for things (like the assholes that channel Angels and make up all this theoritical bullshit about the nature of the human spirit - if we could possibly comprehend it, we'd be like God. And we're not. So even trying to find a name for it is pointless. It's ineffable, and I'm happy enough to view it as such). I Googled this for you and you might want to check into this: http://www.anzua.org/anzua_alt/ - this group is in Western Australia. Good luck, sweetie. I know about the difficulties of finding a church that doesn't fit the standard beliefs:)

That's the religion I belong to. Unitarian Universalism is what it's called in the United States and Canada. http://uua.org/ In England it's the Unitarian Church.

[strangedave.livejournal.com]

Hey, the Perth ones meet a block or two away.
They probably are a choice worth investigating for someone who basically believes in the New Testament Christian message, but not the rest of what comes along with it.

Oh, and just for the record Nacey - no modern Christian accepts all the Old Testament as is, and anyone who tells you otherwise just hasn't read the damn thing.

[annearchy.livejournal.com]

Somehow the 2 parts of my post came in bassackwards. The last sentence replies to your quote :) *headdesk*

[http://users.livejournal.com/doctor_k_/]

Have you tried the Belief-o-matic? http://www.beliefnet.com/story/76/story_7665_1.html

Having been raised Presbyterian, then deciding it wasn't for me, I wasn't quite sure what to call my lack of religion. Belief-o-matic was great - i discovered that I'm a humanist, and there's lots of people like me!

My mum's still Christian, Church Elder, Bible study once a week and all that, but she's also a bit of a heretic. Not only does she not believe in Hell, but she doesn't believe in Heaven or any sort of an after-life. I'm quite intrigued by this, as I thought Heaven was a fairly central part of the whole religion thang.

As far as walking one's own path to enlightenment, I think even as a humanist this is an important aspect of life. Not goal, or mission, but part of daily life. I use a little bit of Jung, a little bit of Kabbalah, a little bit of tarot study, and a whole lot of relationship and personal reading, therapy and counselling in my path. I think different things are useful at different points, and there's no one right answer/path. Everyone needs a little bit of several different approaches. It's kinda like how if you learn different languages, you learn different ways of thinking about the same things.

[hipikat.livejournal.com]

Hmm. I'm quite atheistic and that was fairly obvious from the answers I provided, yet behold my top six, below... From the blurbs, it seems to have fallen that way because I had a little belief that the human condition can be improved by humans :)

1. Unitarian Universalism (100%)
2. Secular Humanism (88%)
3. Liberal Quakers (82%)
4. Mainline to Liberal Christian Protestants (78%)
5. Theravada Buddhism (76%)
6. Nontheist (65%)

[logansrogue.livejournal.com]

Adam, that - is an odd thing to say. If the human condition can't be improved by humans, then who can it be improved by? I mean - okay. To me, it's like... I was not able to get into the course I wanted. I only got into the course because *I* made it happen. I fixed my own problem. I think that humanity's problems are pretty much the same way. Life wouldn't suck so much if we weren't such a pack of assholes. LOL!! Anyway. Maybe the belief-o-matic expected you to want to believe something in the first place? It's like - why try on a hat if you don't want a hat? To try on a hat, one assumes that you want one. Uhm. I'm exploding with ridiculous metaphors tonight. I'm going to bed before I say anything else stupid.

[hipikat.livejournal.com]

Nonono, I mean 'I do have a little bit of belief', not 'I have very little belief' :)

[logansrogue.livejournal.com]

Oh. Okay then. You confused me, silly duff. *cuddle*

[dejaspirit.livejournal.com]

Hee. Just gave her #1 advice. LOL.

[word-waterfall.livejournal.com]

*Hand up* I'll join your religion.

[dejaspirit.livejournal.com]

It's called Universal Unitarianism. If I weren't a lazy ass, I'd go there.

[annearchy.livejournal.com]

That's what I told her. But I actually do go there (well, not to the one in Australia ;)

[http://users.livejournal.com/lothar_/]

I'm facing much the same crisis. Since there are always good reasons for dissenting with a particular brand of theology or interpretation of a holy book (there's no such thing as a "literal reading", or else there wouldn't be so many schisms within a religion), there's really no "right" religion or sect.

Nevertheless, I'm seriously considering going to a Methodist church after not belonging to any church for so long. It's the one that I had the most childhood experience going to (but not the religion of my parents, oddly enough; more a grandparent thing), it's not fundamentalist/evangelical, it has a longer tradition and is therefore more trustworthy than the "independent" churches that spring up when members of a larger church had a fuss, and it's just down the street from my house.

I went to a Unitarian Universalist church for a little while, but the whole thing was so watered-down and DIY that it made me ask, "Why bother going at all?" Still, it might be a good idea to go if you want to "sample" different religions before finding the one that's right for you.

[azinazelle.livejournal.com]

Try the Unitarian Church babes. It includes all system of beliefs and encourages individual enlightenment. I'm Catholic. Doesn't mean I buy into everything, but I feel God has led me personally on this path to make a difference somehow.

As for Goddess ... I believe God the Father is also Goddess the Mother since God cannot be limited to one sex. God is male and female. Didn't it say in The Bible man and woman God created them in God's own image?

Didn't it say in The Bible man and woman God created them in God's own image?

[http://users.livejournal.com/doctor_k_/]

Um, not really. Created man in His image, then nicked a rib from Adam and turned it into Eve.
Not sure where Lilith fits in though.

And poor Noah in Genesis! First God wants him to take two of every animal onto the ark, then it's 6, then 7! Oh God, make up Your mind already!

(as a humanist who thinks the Old Testament is not so much God's Word, but more an interesting history of Israel and the early Christian church)

Which reminds me - we must play Credo again. You get to play competing early Christian faiths, battling it out to have your beliefs make it into the (Nicene) Creed. It sure makes you stop and think about how the Christian Church became what it is today - it was all politics, baby!

Re: Didn't it say in The Bible man and woman God created them in God's own image?

[logansrogue.livejournal.com]

Totally was. Finding that out reading this book. Wow!

[jakie-em.livejournal.com]

I have an issue with all religions. we are taught from a young age about religions and we start to get a dependance on them. we dont realise that we need them, but aspects of them are always around us with Xmas and Easter.

We start to expect them to be around us and we envelop ourselves in these holidays. we then envelop ourselves in the things that these holidays meant to us... then to the religion itself.

When it comes to belief though, I have hope in the human race to do right, I have faith in people being able to improve.

In myself I just want to be a better person, religion wont necessarily do that though. even a religion that is OK with other faiths may not be OK with different people or different ways of life.

All I can hope is that I am a good person and that people see me as that. I accept other people and (misguidedly perhaps) have love for all people and our world. find me a religion that does that

[logansrogue.livejournal.com]

See... I don't really - to me, religion is just another way of accessing something that exists to me. I don't depend on any one religion.

It's like this... You don't 'believe in trees' do you? You just know they exist, what they do, how they function. It's like that for me and the Spirit. Too much has happened to me to show me that it's there, so, I think it's just there. I don't 'believe' in it, cause that would mean to me that some part of me doubts that it's there. And I don't.

I guess I just want to learn more spiritual wisdom, and I'm a bit short for material. *nods* And it bothers me that no matter where I turn, not one source has kinda made me feel at home. (Christian Spiritualists are the closest I've come so far).

[azinazelle.livejournal.com]

I'll pray that God will show you the path that will bring you the greatest enlightenment. I feel at home where I am, despite not knowing everybody at church and not being raised in it. I feel Jesus wants me to do something for others and perhaps this is the best place to do it for me.

[logansrogue.livejournal.com]

Cool. I think this particular brand of Gnosticism that I'm reading about in this book at the moment is kinda perfect for me. But I'll blend Christian Spiritualism in there too. And Pagan Mysticism.

[tha-prez.livejournal.com]

how about buddism?

[logansrogue.livejournal.com]

Well, I like a lot of things about Buddhism. I'd like to read more about Buddhism. I probably already believe a lot of the stuff in Buddhism, particularly since I *adored* the bits of wisdom they'd tell you at the end of Monkey as a kid. :)

[http://users.livejournal.com/doctor_k_/]

Now, have you watched John Safran Vs God? Basically he goes out and roadtrials a variety of religions to make the choice easier for us.

[logansrogue.livejournal.com]

That sounds really funny LOL

[aeditimi.livejournal.com]

The religion you describe sounds very much like Unitarian Universalism. In this religion major/pastor's opinion. And it's not like me to promote "the competition" (as I'm Methodist), but I'd really check the U.U. church out.

[rainfletcher.livejournal.com]

First of all, organized religion makes my teeth hurt. Organized religion with secrets given only to the initiated... now, that makes me want to run away screaming.

My father was Catholic, and my mother is from a family chock full of Freemasons and Eastern Star (speaking of organized and secretive), and perhaps as a consequence, I had a very vague religious upbringing. I hit a major crisis of faith in late high school and early college because none of it made any sense. I spoke to a lot of people about mysticism and shamanism and humanism and philosophy, learned things about Eastern religion, and kind of walked a wobbly road for a while, trying to reconcile Love Thy Neighbor with personal experiences like a gay friend getting drummed out of his church for, well, being gay.

Then about ten years ago I was in a teeny little seven-voice madrigal group, and we were performing at a service in a little middle-of-the-road Protestant church, and the pastor gave the most incredible sermon. He said that doing God's work is not a matter of saying the right words, because words mean nothing. God speaks to everyone, and you can tell by the actions of each person whether or not he or she hears the voice. You can tell by how they live their lives, and how they strive to make the world better for their presence, and to touch the lives of others. Some will call themselves Christians, some will be of other religions, and some will even call themselves Atheists and be very clear about how they do not believe in God, but still they do God's work, and will know God's love. And some of those who profess so loudly that they are His Chosen, and His Servants... they do not hear the voice of God, because they've drowned it out with their own words. And you will know them by their deeds as well... and so will God.

Blew me the hell away. Here, finally, for the first time in my life, was a Christian saying that the most important thing was to actually live the way that Jesus taught, and not to simply say that you were a Christian. Finally someone was admitting that Heaven was not just for Our Side, and that other people could be truly GOOD people whether they wore our label or not. It didn't all have to be dogma and hellfire.

So in the long run, I think I wound up with a very personal religion, and a very unique relationship with God, and I think that's just fine.

As a consequence, I have little to no patience with organized religion and the way they try to pre-package everything for you, with everything pre-decided and leaving you no room to find your own way. And if those other guys are right, and God put us all on this world to sing Hosanna and praise him and scratch his back for him while being tiny-minded, petty, cruel beings with no tolerance for anyone outside of our tiny-minded, petty, cruel view of the world... well, I'll have lots of company in Hell, now, won't I?

Gads, I have a tendency to ramble on your journal, don't I?

[logansrogue.livejournal.com]

Ramble you may, but you've helped me a lot.

And I kinda misunderstood what they meant in this book. There are just levels of understanding with the bible, and those that are further along spiritually understand it differently than those that are just starting to think that way. Or something. It's not like it's all secret - it's all there for people to see, they just need to think about things first to understand them.

Anyway, thanks for the story, I've found it very helpful. :)